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White Knuckles Interview Questions
Writer / Director / Producer Kevin K. Shah

1. Your script was developed in a very non conventional manner. In fact, it would probably make traditionalists cringe. Can you explain what your “scroutline” is?

What is a Scroutline?  I’ve never head anyone else use the word as it sounds mildly offensive… but it’s actually an outline that has moments that are scripted in it.  It’s really the only way I know how to develop a script — and I’ve written several this way.  There’s no real magic to a scroutline — it’s just the beats of the story, with the scenes that inspire me first completely written out with dialogue so that I  can begin to hear the voices of the characters during the outline phase.  Often one needs to write a whole draft of your script before you find the voices and must begin again.  The scroutline saves time for this otherwise necessary process.  There’s a short sliver from the scroutline on the White Knuckles site — it’s interesting to see how the words on the page transformed as it passed through William (played magnificently by Larry Strauss) on set.  I’m currently working on a scroutline for A Falling Rock, a thriller — and it is roughly 88 pages so far, which means it is time to script.

2. I’ve heard other filmmakers mention that not having a script is by no means to be confused with less work. Having a deep understanding of the story and characters is essential if you want your film to work. But how did you maintain structure and tension?

Even though the films we make at Sabi tend to go off script entirely (and in the case of White Knuckles and Heart of Now were designed to ‘lose the script’ during the 2nd act and create as much as possible in the moment) — I actually feel like you need / should  have some semblance of a script to begin with.  A script is how people understand step 1 of a film, and without it there are several other steps that need to be taken before getting to step 1.

That is to say that even with an improvisational film having a script saves having to get a huge number of people up to speed on what the project is (and what the project can potentially become with everyone’s interdependent involvement).  We’re famous for having a ‘crew-read thru’ instead of a cast table read so that the crew (who all play a part at the read) know what it is we’re doing.  It ensures that the director gets to hear it on its feet at least once, the crew gets to bond and know the story at the same time, and the team gets to talk about what it means to depart from the script — and how we can create an environment for the cast to fell safe in doing so.  We couldn’t do this without a final script.

Conversely, our very first feature film (made with a collaborative named Unica) called Blue in Green (co directed with M. David Melvin & Zak Forsman) did not have a script — which is how we were trained.  But in the case of Blue in Green, we worked with the actors in intensive rehearsals over 6 weeks before we started shooting to ensure everyone understood the characters and the dynamics needed to create structure and tension.  For that film, we only had a 2 page beat sheet going into it and no real 3rd act — much of the rest was successfully and painstakingly created in the edit & with re-shoots (which is also a part of our process).  At Sabi Pictures, we learned on that first film we worked on long ago, that there’s just not the luxury of time for most cast & crew — and so the script is ultimately a quick springboard upon which the dialogue and creative input can ensue.

3. Would you direct another film using the same story telling methods?

I spend my days on studio sets doing behind the scenes for several notable directors so I’ve seen how it is traditionally (and very successfully) done with slightly more conventional methods.  I also have seen directors like Gus Van Sant and George Clooney use a lot of our methods refined for their own work & process.  I can say without hesitation that this to me — is making movies.  Making films interdependently is creative, exciting, filled with fun and surprise & intensely collaborative and creative in every sense of the words.

4. You’ve mentioned that you need to come up with a script for the purpose of sides, scheduling, and other such tasks. How long did your scriptwriting process take? What was your writing routine?

Scripting takes about a month or two — but the Scroutline phase as described above takes a year (or more).  In the case of White Knuckles the scroutline started about 5 years before scripting — as I was just formulating ideas and story elements & asking myself questions:  How can a woman poison her own husband?  How does she get the idea?  What would motivate her?  The routine that follows that (which the scroutline is locked) is pedal to the metal writing — often this means become reclusive for the time it takes to get a first solid draft out.  Revising afterwards is fun, as the script gets to people that will help make it better with each new pass.

At some point, however — all scripting stops, the project is greenlit — and casting begins.  After that, there will be one more revision for the actors that will play the roles (and the ideas they have brought) before we lock the script to begin shooting.  Often, only the director and producer has these revisions.  Shortly after that — we lock schedule and begin shooting.  And not longer after that, we toss the screenplay entirely.

5. How did you go about casting for the film? Did you use union? Non-union actors? How many actors did you see in total before you made your final choices?

Casting Heart of Now and White Knuckles used both Union and Non-Union actors.  Two of the leads in both films were Non-Union at the time.  However, we made sure the stars as well as any of our smaller roles were treated as if they were union, with the proper attention to financial needs, safety, comfort & professionalism.  Every role in our films have a feature length story attached to them — so we treat everyone with respect.  2 of the characters in Heart of Now are also in White Knuckles — as both films are different but from the same universe.  Simply put — we at Sabi love our actors.  They make everything happen and the most important collaboration happens between them and the director on set and in the moment — so we try to erase titles and distinctions as soon as we can & make it so that everyone is equal.

There are a lot of non-uniuon actors out there that are golden, it just takes patience to find them and cultivate them with our process.  In the case of both films we saw hundreds of people for all the roles and weeded through thousands of head-shots.  I recall that we had roughly 700 submissions (both union on Non) for lead actress age bracket 21-27.  Whew.  Marion Kerr got the role and was perfect as Amber in White Knuckles & Heart of Now.

6. You mentioned your “gut instincts” when referencing your casting process. This “gut feeling” is often a director’s most valuable tool. Have you been able to find any insight into what triggers it for you?

I’m not quite sure but it has something to do with the eyes, and if I can believe what is happening through their eyes.  There is so much that is said with eye contact, I’m looking to make sure the actor is truly ‘in the moment’ and not self-directing or floundering with intention that needs to be adjusted or shifted.  It’s a process — so often if I don’t have the ‘gut feeling’ we try things out until something pops rather than move on right away (either in casting or on set).  Sometimes the gut feeling is so strong it can stop or start everything.  I remember talking to Zak Forsman before we locked Martie Ashworth to play the role of Julie — and saying that if she couldn’t do the film we’d delay the schedule until she could.

7. White knuckles is beautifully shot. What camera did you use?

White Knuckles was shot by cinematographer Addison Brock III on  two HVX 200′s without lenses.  To create depth of field we often pushed in and put the cameras on glide-cams.  It was an amazing & intimate (and fast) way to work and the imagery is stunning.

8. What did your lighting kit consist of?

We had Several China Balls of various sizes, 4 Kino Flo 400′s, a huge number of practicals (we love practicals) and of course the sun.  We made sure that we experienced the light and time of day for each scene in each environment before we shot there for Heart of Now as well as White Knuckles (and our short films).  It’s important to see what the light is doing before you begin shooting in a space.

9. Fill in the blank. I wish I had more ___________ to shoot this film.

Behind the Scenes Still Photographer

10. After you were done casting how did you go about your rehearsal process?

Rehearsals were meetings with the director and other pertinent cast members where we’d discuss the characters, the intentions for the scenes, and talk about how the story might change before the end.  There was very little focus on the lines or the screenplay apart from answering several questions from the actors (which tends to happen with the provocative nature of our material).

Then, before we “officially” begin shooting — we do a full-on shoot (which Sabi Pictures calls “pre-shoots”).  With White Knuckles it was complete with the leads, entire crew, on camera / with sound & lighting.  During pre-shoots, we capture some scenes that could very well be used in the story — but could also be cut of things go wrong/need to be ironed out.  It’s actually a rehearsal for the entire company.  This gives us a running start for day 1 of principal photography.

11. How long did it take to shoot White Knuckles?

White Knuckles had a production schedule of 23 days including re-shoots, pre-shoots & b-unit.  It took just over a month.

12. How long did it take to edit white knuckles?

Roughly 15 months all-told.

13. What is the budget (est) of the film?

It’s hard to say because we absorbed so much of the cost in our own post-production facility and we deferred all the top-line pay (Director, DOP, Editor, Co-Producer, etc.)  Our catering and crafty budget was in the thousands, so that’s something.

14. What is your distribution strategy for the film?

We’re creating our own VOD portal through cinefist.com – which will be the distribution hub for the film.  We will make it available on DVD along with an intensive behind the scenes about our process.  We also are submitting to festivals but intend to screen the film theatrically ourselves in limited release across the US.

Coffee houses, screening series, film schools, local independent arthouse theaters are all part of the game plan.

15. Many of our film students are aspiring to be feature film directors. If you could give aspiring directors three pieces of advice, or three areas to focus their energies on what would they be?

1.  Erase the big deal from your strategy and focus all your effort on Plan B – which should be doing it yourself.

2.  You will be (at the beginning and at the end of the process of your film) the single person keeping the flame of it alive.  This is a huge responsibility and takes great sacrifice, financially, physically, mentally, spiritually.  The more you are willing to sacrifice for your passion project, the better it will be.  Most of all, you need to find a team that is willing to do the same (to reasonable limits).

3.  Push yourself forward creatively, and get yourself out there using the new tools we have available via the internet.  Let us know what you’re working on & how you’re making it happen.  There is no longer a way you can exist in the changing landscape of motion pictures without effort in this regard.

A fairly recent change has been YouTube’s “rental” option for indie filmmakers. Youtube started this program with their partnership with Sundance Film Festival. They started showing 5 Sundance films including Bass Ackwards, Children of Invention, The cover, One too Many Mornings and Homewrecker. They have since opened up the program to include other independent films as well.

Watch YouTube’s promo ad for this program below.

What’s interesting is that they are giving  filmmakers the freedom to set their own rental prices and rental lengths. Some films may cost $2.99 for 48 hours while others may cost $5.99 for 7 days.  Not only is YouTube giving filmmakers freedom to set their own prices, but it also seems like the majority of the profits are going towards the filmmakers.

The visitor stats for these rentable videos are still visible and while the results are modest, they are still promising. YouTube does not claim exclusive rights to the content which means you’re free to distribute your film on any other VOD platform as well. It will be interesting to see how this program develops.

To learn more about this program visit YouTube’s Filmmakers Wanted page.

1. Can you introduce yourself and your project as well as tell us how it all came together?

Dawn: My name is Dawn Mikkelson and I am the Executive Producer and Co-Director of The Red Tail. Living in Minnesota, Northwest Airlines was one of the big hometown companies. Everyone knows someone who has previously or currently works for NWA (now Delta). When the mechanics went on strike, it was a unique time for this company in that the hometown public had grown sick of this airline taking taxpayer dollars, making big promises for jobs, and then letting its top management walk off with millions of dollars while the workers were making less and less. I started the film in the fall of 2005, wanting to look at NWA as a working example of what appeared to be happening across the country to the working class. It started as a film that was much more about a company, with the workers as secondary characters. I met Melissa about 6 months into production. She joined me as an intern whose father was a striking mechanic. Through conversations I learned that she had footage of her father and the first few critical weeks of the strike. As Melissa and I got to know each other better, it became clear that her family’s story was a much more compelling way of approaching this overall situation of the working class. We decided to join forces and she and I share the directing role in The Red Tail.

Melissa: My name is Melissa Koch and I am the Director, Producer and Editor of The Red Tail. I started this project in August of 2005 when the AMFA mechanics went on strike against Northwest Airlines. I saw the story of my father (an aircraft mechanic for 38 years) and his fellow mechanics struggling to keep their jobs in the face of outsourcing as a microcosm of what American workers, and many workers globally are dealing with — a global economy that prioritizes profit above human and social costs. I think it is often true that the strongest and most effective films are those that deal with issues the filmmakers have a genuine personal connection to and a very nuanced understanding of. I couldn’t pass up the chance as a filmmaker to look at the some of the most pressing issues of our time — capitalism, the global economy, outsourcing, corporate ir/responsibility, declining power of unions, and everyday people taking a stand — through the lens of my own fathers experience.

2. At one point in your filmmaking process you had two documentary teams join into one team with a similar goal. Can you explain how this came about? How did you divide up control and responsibility? Or was that even an issue?

Dawn: I think any time you have two creative, passionate individuals working together, you are bound to have conflict. But you are also going to create a film that is much more nuanced and full than what either would have had on their own. As I said above, we decided to do this together about 6-8 months after my production had started. We did a lot of emotional and storytelling check-ins to make sure that we were both moving in the direction we wanted to go. The reason I have the additional title as Executive Producer is that I have more experience and connections, so I was able to pull together resources for the project that may not have otherwise been available. The Red Tail is my fourth feature documentary and Melissa’s first. I also have a production company called Emergence Pictures that makes doc-style videos for primarily nonprofits, so many of the equipment resources and such came from my company. In terms of creative control and such, we did our best to hear one another and make all big decisions together. During the edit we had an external drive that we would shuttle between our two homes, so we would each take stabs at the edit and then come together periodically to tackle the bigger questions.

Melissa: Dawn started working on The Red Tail shortly after I started working on a film about the strike. She was approached by a flight attendant that wanted her video production company to make a film about all the Northwest Airlines work groups — the flight attendants, mechanics, & pilots — and what the company was doing to them. I saw one of Dawn’s fliers advertising that she was raising money to make a trailer for the film. Knowing that Dawn had more resources and experience, I contacted her to see if I could assist in production in hopes that we could forge a creative partnership down the line if that made sense. After interning for her for a while, I proposed we change the direction of the film to follow an aircraft mechanic to China to meet the workers who are doing the outsourced work. Dawn agreed that the film needed both a more personal and more global approach, so we moved forward from there and eventually decided to share the directorial role. This process was complicated at times because we had varied levels of experience and different creative visions initially. Over time I think we came to a shared vision for the film, and I am certain the The Red Tail would be a very different film had one of us done it alone. I think uniting our different strengths elevated The Red Tail both creatively and technically.

3. Ethics in documentary filmmaking is a widely discussed topic. Based on the subject matter and locations of your film this issue was sure to come up. What were some of the biggest ethical decisions you needed to make as you progressed through the film? Did you learn anything about your own standpoint on these issues as you went through this process? Did you ever feel uncomfortable with a decision you were making and how did you deal with it?

Dawn: This is a big question with many potential directions to pursue. Some of the big ethical decisions had to do with the question of interviewing workers in China on camera. There is a sad history of documentary filmmakers interviewing Chinese workers, leaving the country, premiering their film, only to learn later that their subjects have “disappeared”. We did not want to be one of those productions. Because of this, we concealed the identities of our interview subjects. We were dedicated to speaking with average workers and to do that we needed to respect the fact that they had no desire to become international representatives of the Chinese Airline Mechanic.

The other main ethical decision was the choice to enter mainland China covertly with Tourist Visas versus Journalist Visas. Technically, we were not tourists, but as a documentary filmmaker, I NEVER identify as a Journalist either. Journalist visas also require that you have a government representative travel with you. We didn’t feel that that situation would allow us to do the work we needed to do, nor would our subjects speak frankly with us. So we crossed into China at the largest land crossing in two groups. Myself and Adrian Danciu (our Director of Photography) going first with most of the gear, then calling Melissa and Roy when we got in and letting them know it was safe to cross. We had many safeguards and plans for what to do if we were detained at the border or anywhere on the journey, but luckily this was not a problem. Upon returning to Hong Kong, we were told by union activists that there were two other film crews that went into mainland China at about the same time with Journalist Visas and both groups had their gear confiscated at the border on their way into the country. This said to me that we did the right thing by going on Tourist Visas.

Melissa: Of course, The Red Tail presented a multitude of ethical questions and challenges. Every documentary film does and should. The first ethical challenge that came up for me was how to deal with the racist and xenophobic discourse that surrounds so many conversations about outsourcing American jobs to China while making a film about outsourcing to China. Part of my vision for The Red Tail was that it would break down some of those myths and have real conversations between workers on both sides of outsourcing about what challenges each are facing in the context of these country-hopping jobs.

4. Is the trip to China based in the need for confrontation or understanding? How did this experience change from the beginning of the journey to the end of the journey?

Dawn: China was about understanding. The Koch family never blamed the Chinese workers for the situation they faced. And they got what they went for . . . .and then some. I also think it was about creating closure for Roy to really see where his job had gone and to take that journey with his daughter, which brought them closer together. It says a lot when your child really cares about what you’re going through and is willing to go to these lengths to honor your journey.

Melissa: My Dad has never expressed blame towards Chinese workers, but instead has always directed his frustrations towards the company he worked for and a government that allowed that company to outsource his job. The trips to Hong Kong and mainland China where never about confrontation. They were about connection, understanding and really becoming informed about workers perspectives who are part of the chain of outsourcing from the US, to Hong Kong, to mainland China.

5. How have you gone about getting press for your film? Are you your film’s own publicists? And what types of publicity have you found work best so far?

Dawn: We are our own publicists. We’ve been targeting the mainstream and indie media in every town the film screens and have had wonderful press opportunities. Through those opportunities, other press have learned about us including the Huffington Post, which was a great review and validation for us. We are currently focusing our energy on bloggers and organizations that are passionate about union, working class, globalization, and outsourcing issues, as well as professional organizations for teachers and librarians with the hope that this will lead to college/university screenings and DVD sales, as well as screenings and DVD sales to individuals.

Most beneficial is hard to answer right now, as we’re still in the thick of it. It seems that with every good review and quote that we can put on our website and other materials, the more receptive potential partners are to wanting to collaborate with us. So it is kind of a snowball effect. Locally, I have relationships with many of the indie and mainstream media and those relationships make it easier for me to pitch stories and get the publicity we want, but nationally and internationally, all bets are off. So any time we can get someone locally based to speak on our behalf to the media, the more likely we get press.

6. On your website you have “view / host a screening” link. Can you tell us about this feature of the Openindie network?

Dawn: OpenIndie is still in it’s birthing stages, but essentially it’s a resource where audience members can request a screening of a film and when you as a filmmaker see that you have reached a point where you could get a good crowd in a certain city, you post your screening and everyone in that zip code is informed of the screening. They are also working on the capability of individuals holding screenings by paying a certain fee and having the film download onto their computers and then they can screen the film wherever they are. I look forward to this being fully functional. Ultimately, we would like to have audiences more involved in what they want to see and use the film for creating community dialogues.

Outside of OpenIndie, we just had two screenings in the Detroit area last week, hosted by AverageJoeInc.com, a online community of thousands of flight attendants. Most of them work for Delta. They rented a theater and coordinated logistics (including a truck with a big billboard promoting the screening that was parked in the airport employee parking lot for weeks). I attended the screenings and sold DVDs, which covered my travel costs. I look forward to doing more screenings like this around the country with AverageJoeInc.com and other organizations.

7. There was a considerable amount of travel required for your documentary. You mentioned that many of your flights were donated. Did you manage to find companies with the same interests as you, and did you use that to your advantage? How do you recommend other documentary filmmakers approach this strategy in their quest to get both finances and resources to support their vision?

Dawn: We had $0 from companies. Our flights were donated by airline employees from NWA and United, called “buddy passes”. This is a huge question about getting finances. In the case of this film, we had fundraising events from house parties to an evening of music with local bands at a large theater in south Minneapolis. Ultimately we functioned like a nonprofit in this venture.

I have used the same model in previous films as well.

8. You also mentioned that you found funding with “hundreds of individual donors”. Did you use a crowd funding model to finance the documentary?

Dawn: We did not use crowd funding, as it wasn’t really in use as widely when we were raising our main cash in 2005 to 2008. That said, I would consider trying it out now. We also raised money through online appeals to Facebook fans and an email list that is currently around 1000 people. Half of which were interested from my previous work and the other half that came on board specifically for this film.

We had a ton of community support, from donated places to stay to grassroots momentum around our screenings. People really wanted this story told.

Melissa: We raised the bulk of our funding in two ways. The first chunk of money we raised was through online donations on our website. Many strikers and other NWA employees donated, and we also contacted hundreds of organizations that have something to do with labor unions and working class issues and asked them to put a banner add that if clicked on would direct users from their website to The Red Tail. This directed a ton of traffic to our site and helped boost our online donations. Another successful fundraiser was an event we had with a silent auction, food & drinks, a preview of the The Red Tail, and several local bands who are part of the soundtrack of the film. That proceeds from that event covered our costs for the trip to and production in mainland China.

9. I notice that you’re using Amazon Video on Demand. How well has this platform serviced your needs as documentary filmmakers?

Dawn: Honestly, so far I’m not terribly impressed. It took MONTHS to process on their end, we get a very small cut of the proceeds, and we have no way of knowing where people learn about the film, where they were referred from, etc, because Amazon/Create Space keep this information from us. That said, it is one of the only online pay platforms that the general public knows about and so it was worth the experiment.

10. From a distribution standpoint what is some of the best advice you could give aspiring documentary filmmakers?

Dawn: At least half of your work on your film will be in distribution and the odds are that you will be doing this on your own, so you might as well learn to enjoy it. Here’s an article I wrote for MovieMaker Magazine on that topic.

Melissa: Create a distribution plan as soon as possible. If you can, do it before you start shooting your film. Independent distribution is exciting and tedious and the more solid your plan is ahead of time, the better position you will be in when you wrap post production and try to get your film in front of audiences. While it is important to have a festival strategy, it is also important to screen your film as much as possible in front of audiences (sell them your DVD’s!), press press press, link up with organizations and individuals who are passionate about your project, research all different distribution platforms and utilize them, create a great website that is active and participatory, say yes to as many opportunities as you can because they will likely lead to more opportunities.

11. How long did this documentary take you to complete

Dawn: Aug 2005 to July 2009. So 4 years.

12. What was the budget for this documentary?

Dawn: Actual budget was around $230,000-250,000. That would presume that everyone got paid for their work. Actual cash that paid for travel and a few additional expenses . . . More along the lines of $35,000.

13. You have quite a few theatrical screenings. What has been your film festival strategy?

Dawn: Thank you. Started with the top 10-20 international film festival and waited for a premiere. That said, we did sneak previews at ones before then that made sense for our audience, such as Minneapolis/St. Paul International Film Festival (NWA hometown) and Reel Work May Day Labor Film festival in Santa Cruz. We’ve been active in contacting conferences and gatherings of our target audience and some of those contacts have paid off. And again, this is like a snowball. Once you have a couple, festival programmers and organizers listen to each other and the media.

One thing I will say, festivals are great for creating buzz, liner notes, good press, etc. These things all help you sell your film down the road. But I think one of the biggest mistakes young filmmakers make is to presume that a festival is the end of the journey and that some big distributor will then whisk them off into the world of success. This is rarely the case and shouldn’t be your only plan. Odds are that festivals are just the beginning of a long journey of distribution.

14. Both of you seemed to have very different ideas about how to approach your documentary’s story. Dawn seemed to want to use NWA as a case study and a jumping off point for a larger discussion on the topic of globalization. Melissa on the other hand was working on a story about her father that really humanized the documentary. From a narrative storytelling standpoint it seems that Dawn was focused on the film’s plot and Melissa was focused on the film’s characters. How important do you think it is to humanize these large political, social and economic stories?

For example, one of our students wants to start filming a documentary about food production methods, but he’s having a difficult time balancing “issue” with “character”. I cautioned him about not having a character (or characters) to embody on a personal level, the conflict your discussing on a whole. Can you talk about the pros  and cons of using this method of story telling?

Dawn: Historically, all my films revolve around 1-3 central characters navigating their way through a larger social issue.  From the ordination of a lesbian minister in THIS obedience to illuminate the struggle over sexuality and religion in mainline Christian churches to the intimate stories of Cree and Metis residents about how their lives have been devastated by massive flooding from a large-scale hydroelectric dam in Manitoba in Green Green Water.  The Red Tail was no different.  I was really struggling with The Red Tail when Melissa and I decided to merge visions for that very reason, as the film didn’t have those characters yet.  This film reminded me of the importance of this approach.

Ultimately, my approach to documentary filmmaking is an emotional one.  I believe that documentary film’s largest strength is its ability to impact an audience on an emotional level and that is the level where we make our big decisions, if we’re honest with ourselves.  Sure, we need facts and intellectual arguments to help us along the journey in deciding how we feel about an issue, but ultimately this decision is made when we FEEL the answer.  The impact of personal stories and experiences is the best way to get to that emotional answer.

I would imagine you advised your student that there is danger in having any character “embody” any conflict, as it ultimately impacts that person quite a bit.  It is a lot of pressure for your subject, especially if the film does well, to be considered the working example of an issue in the public eye.  That said, the way we constructed The Red Tail and the way I construct my other films it is clear that these characters are just one example of multitudes of individuals.  After screenings, the biggest comment I hear is how Roy’s story reminds the audience of their own story or of the story of someone they love.  They see it for what it is, a small representation of a universal experience.  This is all presuming that the character you focus on is someone with much personal integrity and someone the audience will likely relate to.  Obviously the opposite effect could occur if you have a character that has little integrity representing an issue.

Bringing me back to The Red Tail.  Until I met Melissa and Roy, I hadn’t found that person that could really represent this story the way they do.  They are a family of honest people, who really don’t want to be the leaders of a movement, and reflect the type of folks you would want as friends and I am happy to say became my friends . . . The other great benefit of documentary film.

Melissa: As a filmmaker, I am drawn to deeply personal stories that give audiences an emotional access point to larger social and ideological conflicts. I think it vitally important to have a character/s that can bring an audience through a story, personalize larger issues, and make a documentary more compelling. If I take The Red Tail as an example — The story of Northwest Airlines outsourcing work, cutting labor costs, breaking unions, filing bankruptcy while giving huge bonuses to executives, and merging with Delta into the largest airline in the world is certainly an important issue, but for me it doesn’t make for a film on it’s own. Following my father’s process with a labor strike and then his journey to meet the worker that replaced him is the heart of the story. Without him as a character, not only would people not watch the film as much, they wouldn’t get as much out of it. His emotional journey and the struggle of the striking workers are what shed such blinding light on the larger “issues”.

We tried to take a somewhat narrative film approach to the structure of The Red Tail. We actually consulted with narrative writers and filmmakers more than with documentary filmmakers because we both felt that the more we could structure the film like a narrative, the more accessible and compelling it would be.

To your student who is interested in making a doc about food production methods, I would ask — What is your story? Is it someone who works in food production who is impacted by the methods? Is a consumer who is being effected by processing methods? Is it the small local farm/food processor that is doing it a different way and why? Is your character someone who is fighting to change food production methods? Find your story — and hopefully you will find your character/s with it.

Purchasing & Screening Information:

* To buy DVD’s, schedule a screening, or learn more visit http://www.redtailmovie.com
* The best way to hear about things as they happen with The Red Tail is to be our fan on Facebook. http://www.facebook.com/theredtail

With the democratization of both the production and distribution process filmmakers are increasingly curious to know how to create and distribute successful independent films.

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If you would be interested in receiving this type of press / publicity please contact us. In the subject line of your email type “Film Interview”. In the body of the email include your name, your film’s title, the film’s trailer and website (if you have one) and we’ll get back to those who we’d be interested in interviewing.

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We interviewed Tao about his production and distribution strategies in the hopes that it not only inspires other independent filmmakers, but also helps provide insight into self distribution strategies.

Film Trailer

Tell us about yourself and how you came to complete this feature.

FIX is inspired by a true story: My brother, a very charming, larger-than-life character in real life, was struggling with drug addiction. The law caught up with him, and he was offered a deal by the judge: if he didn’t check himself into rehab in 10 days, he would be sent to prison for three years. On the 8th day, he was arrested again, for something else. His lawyer called me while I was working on a documentary in San Francisco, and said, “If someone doesn’t bail him out of jail and get him to rehab by 8pm tomorrow, he is going to prison for three years.” So I drove overnight to bail him out and soon found out that the rehab wouldn’t accept him without a non-refundable $5000 deposit. Since we didn’t have the money, the day turned into a race to get the funds before the 8 o’clock deadline.

Four years later, my wife Olivia Wilde and I had the idea of turning this premise into my first narrative feature film. I knew it was time for me to move into scripted features and I was also dying to work with Olivia, who was developing into an incredible actress. We always joked that while we had gotten married after only knowing each other for six months, the real commitment (and risk) it takes to make a film together required four years. Given my background in guerilla-style documentary filmmaking, I wanted to use the language I had developed in that medium and apply it to my first narrative project. In that way, I hoped to get the best of both worlds: the immediacy and realism of documentary and the structure and story arc of scripted, fictional work. Given advances in digital media, I was also excited by the fact that we could do this without sacrificing my love of photography and “cinematic” imagery. The process and result turned out to be more gratifying than I ever could have imagined. Seeing Shawn Andrews bring his own vision and spirit to the Leo character was delightful. Shooting was adventurous and fun, and bringing the film to festivals around the world and seeing how the film touched people from so many walks of life was more than I ever dreamed of. I am excited for the film to now reach an even larger audience with this fall’s release.

Tell us about your film background.

I studied philosophy at UC Berkeley and took a class there called Existentialism in Literature and Film. It was that course that inspired me to become a filmmaker. I was then lucky enough to work as an assistant to the academy award winning production designer Dean Tavoularis and then for cinematographer Vittorio Storaro. While I loved those experiences and admired these masters, I quickly realized that I was interested in a very different kind of filmmaking. I was drawn to an approach that may only be possible with the digital tools we have at our disposal today which makes filmmaking more immediate, personal and less tied to financial concerns.

Tell us a little bit the size of your crew and the people involved.

The entire cast and crew was alway between 10-15 people. We would all go to set in my funky 1970s GMC rv, which served as craft service, hair, make-up, wardrobe, editorial, grip, electric and transportation

What Camera did you shoot on?

Panasonic HVX 200

What did your lighting kit consist of?

We used mostly natural light, augmented in a few of the interiors by my wonderful DP, Christopher Gallo. We then did a ton of color correction to achieve the looks we got.

How long did you cast for?

Several months with extraordinary casting directors David Rapaport and Lindsay Kroeger.

What drew your towards your lead actors?

I’m married to Olivia Wilde and the role of Bella was written for her. Our best friend is Megalyn Echikunwoke, and the role of Carmen was written for her. The most difficult part of the process was casting the Leo character. I met with dozens of actors before meeting Shawn Andrews who turned out to be more than perfect for the role.

What was your planned budget for the film?

$300,000

What was your actual budget for this film?

$300,000

What were some of the biggest downfalls to working within a tight budget?

One always wishes to have more time, but other than that we were pleased to have so much money! Hollywood accustoms us to thinking that we need millions and millions of dollars to make a film, but if you keep things in perspective, $300,000 is still a lot of money.

Can you explain how you came up with the funding to shoot the film? Did you secure financing before you wrote the script or did you get financing after?

I started out raising money online, offering anyone who gave any money to the project an “associate producer” credit. After several months of this and after working on the script, I was lucky enough to find 2 private investors to finance the rest of the film.

Did you work inside our outside of the studio system to get this film shot?

Totally outside.

Can you explain how this film found a distribution deal?

We are working with a company called E1 for DVD distribution and we are doing a hybrid theatrical release–working with a booker to get the film into individual theaters.

How much of a role do you play in helping to promote the film?

A huge role. It is no longer realistic to expect to sell your film and have someone else do all the work for you.

Do you feel the film was sacrificed at all being shot on a relatively small budget? If so, where can you see these compromised in the film?

No, given our documentary style, we were able to focus on performance much more than most films of this size; and given the extraordinary advances in high definition digital video, the film looked as beautiful as most films shot with 10 times the budget.

Foreign sales prospects are looking more hopeful than ever. Countries in these emerging markets are now seeking all rights deals for up to $20,000 for independent films.

What’s interesting is that in many cases theatrical release is not a sustainable strategy for independent filmmakers since it’s used primarily as a loss leader. Paying advances, along with print and advertising costs are a substantial part of the release budget and since the distributor is splitting the money with the exhibitor (roughly 50 percent goes to each party), the distribution company doesn’t often make much money in this process after recouping expenses. The filmmaker often makes NO money in this process. Watch the following video to learn more about this process from a distributor who has over 13 years experience.

The video is over an hour long, but it’s interesting because they talk about unconventional methods of distribution. The filmmakers use creative PR and the internet to help them distribute their films.

Another interesting point is that they discuss breaking away from film festivals and governments for help making and distributing their films.

They discuss issues of web promotion, Video On Demand (VOD), ARG, film festivals, screenings and an assortment of interesting and unique ideas that engage the film audience through various methods.

These films were made on shoestring budgets and in some cases have grossed millions of dollars.

Before you read the 5 part interview you can watch the trailer for the film below.

1. What was your planned budget for the film?

Your plan at first is always very simple when it comes to the budget of your film. Get your hands on as much money as you can! We knew right off the bat that raising around $300,000 was the best target. That way we could convince actors to do the film for the SAG weekly rate and we knew we could deliver a good film for an amazing budget. Just a side note- the second you decide to shoot a film outside of North America, SAG determines that since you have the money to shoot in a foreign country you can afford to pay the SAG minimum rates. SAG will not allow you to shoot on the SAG ultra low budget scale, which if you were shooting the film in the USA they would grant you in second.

2. What was your actual budget for this film?

We managed to get the film ”in the can” for $305,000. Then after returning back to Los Angeles we had to raise an additional $100,000 to pay for all the Post Production and all the costs of delivering the film to First Look Studios and our foreign distributor as well. So in the end, the actual budget of the film came in at $438,000.

3. What were some of the biggest downfalls to working within a tight budget?

The biggest downfall is easy the fact that you don’t have money in your budget to bail you out of trouble or to after some shots in your head that you only wish you had the time and money to try and get. The upside to this battle is that you have to rely on creativity rather than money to get a lot of things done in your film and quite honestly it absolutely amazing what you can accomplish with creativity on the set.

First I’m going to say something that most first time filmmakers hate to hear.
When I usually speak to a first time filmmaker the conversation goes something like this.

Me: “So you’re film is a drama and it’s about child abuse (obvisously the subject is always different). If you don’t mind me asking, what’s your budget?”

Filmmakers reply: “We think we can get the film done for 2.5 million”.

Now, I’ve never been one to tell a filmmaker they’re crazy. Hell, I was told time and time again that “The Art of Travel” couldn’t be made for our budget of $300,000. So I never want to discourage a filmmaker. But, the one thing I’ve noticed while making indie films, it’s always a safer bet to try and make a film with a smaller budget than trying to go for over a million dollars on your first film. The distribution market in the last few years are FLOODED with lots of films and it’s so dam hard to recoup your money back on a film in the two million dollar range – UNLESSS you spend a million to get the biggest actor you can to be in the lead in your film. Sounds easier said than done. If you do manage to find an actor that will take a million dollar payday (which isn’t too difficult) then you have to convince the actor and all the agents and managers involved that you can actually make the film for a million, and if it’s your first film it’s hard to do! If you have a budget under $500,000 you can usually find a boat load of known actors who will do your film and you’ll have total control of your film!

4. Can you explain how you came up with the funding to shoot the film? Did you secure financing before you wrote the script or did you get financing after? Did you get all of your financing up front or did you need more for post production?

LaBelle, Graciano, and myself were able to use the last two films, “Somewhere” and “Border to Border” as calling cards to investors. But our one major strike against us was that both of those films had not been distributed at the time. But a budget of $300,000 was pretty easy for our investor to swallow and they knew we were using all our connections to go after new television talent, so everyone felt comfortable that we’d make back the investment. Then we also set up the fact that we would only ask for the last $100,000 if we actually did manage to come back to Los Angeles with the film “in the can”. When we did return back with a shot film, the investors had no problem giving us the last $100,000 to complete the film.

LaBelle, Graciano, and myself paid out of our own pockets for the location scout and to Central and South America. Then when we came home and wrote the script and budget was done to reflect shooting script and we could back it up by showing proof from the location scout. Our investors then felt very comfortable about everything and then we had our lawyer draft up all the contracts and then money was sent into an escrow account for us to go and make our film.

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Continue Reading the Interview

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